Document Records/TMR Blues Reissues - Patton/McTell/Shieks

[Mick III]

I can't believe what I see. Congrats, it's awesome !

[shteev]

Holy shit that is awesome. I want a tmr test press! Think u can spare one. Teehheeehee.

[irongiant]

Need some advice here.

I pre-ordered the Document bundle and was excited to receive the Fed Ex shipment the day after the official release. Tucked in with the 13 records was the test pressing for the Patton vol.2. The shipment package itself was dry, tight, no leaks or damage to the box.

Unfortunately, all but four of the LPs were slightly warped. The sound seems fine, but damn!

So I contacted Third Man sales via email, and was asked to send pictures or video. I sent two--one of the worst one, the Patton vol. 1, and one of the least warped, the Sheiks vol. 4.

I was told that since the sound seemed fine (not sure how the sales rep could tell with a shitty iPhone video recording) that Third Man won't replace the warped records. However, the sales rep told me she would send a new Patton vol. 1 since that one had the most warping, which was very nice.

Not sure how I feel about the whole situation, though. I thought Third Man prided itself on quality, and since these are new pressings they should be perfect. I didn't choose to pay for warped records, no matter how lightly warped they are. I don't know if they were somehow damaged on the Fed Ex truck or what--there were record-breaking temps here in TN that weekend. The box could've been next to a heater in the truck or something. Who knows? But vinyl that thick should've held up better, I'd think.

I'm fairly new at collecting vinyl, and this was the first time I've ordered from Third Man, so any advice you guys can give will be much appreciated.

Should I pursue this, or let it go?

Thanks.

[trickster]

Thanks everyone! Here are some pics:


greenshot screen capture


screenshot on pc

This is awesome!
Did you order the bundle with the 4 new releases or the 13 LP one?

[rsimms3]

Need some advice here.

I pre-ordered the Document bundle and was excited to receive the Fed Ex shipment the day after the official release. Tucked in with the 13 records was the test pressing for the Patton vol.2. The shipment package itself was dry, tight, no leaks or damage to the box.

Unfortunately, all but four of the LPs were slightly warped. The sound seems fine, but damn!

So I contacted Third Man sales via email, and was asked to send pictures or video. I sent two--one of the worst one, the Patton vol. 1, and one of the least warped, the Sheiks vol. 4.

I was told that since the sound seemed fine (not sure how the sales rep could tell with a shitty iPhone video recording) that Third Man won't replace the warped records. However, the sales rep told me she would send a new Patton vol. 1 since that one had the most warping, which was very nice.

Not sure how I feel about the whole situation, though. I thought Third Man prided itself on quality, and since these are new pressings they should be perfect. I didn't choose to pay for warped records, no matter how lightly warped they are. I don't know if they were somehow damaged on the Fed Ex truck or what--there were record-breaking temps here in TN that weekend. The box could've been next to a heater in the truck or something. Who knows? But vinyl that thick should've held up better, I'd think.

I'm fairly new at collecting vinyl, and this was the first time I've ordered from Third Man, so any advice you guys can give will be much appreciated.

Should I pursue this, or let it go?

Thanks.

If you read the store FAQ, it essentially says that it's at the sole discretion of TMR to replace/refund defective products. They only explicitly state they will exchange records damaged during transit, no mention of defective products outside of mechanical items (record players). If you feel strongly about it, you could contact your payment method to see if they have some sort of dispute resolution/buyer protection. If you used a credit card, you could pursue a chargeback claim. Similar options available through PayPal.

[woodisgood]

Warped records have been the bain of my existence lately . . . six of the last nine new LPs I've bought have warp issues, varying from not horrible to bouncing-cartridge-head bad. Sub Pop never hesitates to send out replacements; TMR have twice been very good (although I will say they are the only company I know that asks for a video—which I think is actually very fair); Burger is slow but pleasant (they're stoners, whaddayaexpect?); Matador takes forever.

Anyway, rant over. My personal stance has been: If it doesn't affect the sound and isn't ridiculously wavy, I let it be. The thing I hate the MOST is uncentered LPs, where the cartridge is weaving back and forth so much it affects the music. I had fun videoing LP1 of my Willie Nelson Vault—warped AND uncentered.

If the sound isn't affected, just try to ignore how it looks turning. Vinyl quality is taking a hit lately IMO from the big indies.

[BlackJackDavey]

Did you order the bundle with the 4 new releases or the 13 LP one?

I ordered the entire 13 LP bundle. I previously only had vol 3 on color, and wanted the entire collection anyway, so it worked out for me that they offered the set.

[jbharris76]

Need some advice here.

I pre-ordered the Document bundle and was excited to receive the Fed Ex shipment the day after the official release. Tucked in with the 13 records was the test pressing for the Patton vol.2. The shipment package itself was dry, tight, no leaks or damage to the box.

Unfortunately, all but four of the LPs were slightly warped. The sound seems fine, but damn!

So I contacted Third Man sales via email, and was asked to send pictures or video. I sent two--one of the worst one, the Patton vol. 1, and one of the least warped, the Sheiks vol. 4.

I was told that since the sound seemed fine (not sure how the sales rep could tell with a shitty iPhone video recording) that Third Man won't replace the warped records. However, the sales rep told me she would send a new Patton vol. 1 since that one had the most warping, which was very nice.

Not sure how I feel about the whole situation, though. I thought Third Man prided itself on quality, and since these are new pressings they should be perfect. I didn't choose to pay for warped records, no matter how lightly warped they are. I don't know if they were somehow damaged on the Fed Ex truck or what--there were record-breaking temps here in TN that weekend. The box could've been next to a heater in the truck or something. Who knows? But vinyl that thick should've held up better, I'd think.

I'm fairly new at collecting vinyl, and this was the first time I've ordered from Third Man, so any advice you guys can give will be much appreciated.

Should I pursue this, or let it go?

Thanks.

This is a really tough one, the way I see it. So, just giving you my $.02 since you asked. FWIW

Bottom line: only YOU can really make the judgement call here. I have let many (small) things slide with TMR over the years due to the incredibly awesome "extras" they have stuffed into my orders over time (test pressings, for example). That said, whenever I've had a complaint or issue, they've always been on top of it without question. I'm sure, from their end, they know they put a test press in your package. So, you've got to see that side of it, and maybe weigh that in a *bit*. However, that doesn't make selling new records that are warped, "ok", by any means, especially if it effects sound. Personally, if I can play a record (a regular release, I wouldn't stand for a defective limited edition I don't think) without any noticeable defect, I let it slide. I'd let the test press even out any hard feelings I had towards a slightly warped record. That said,if it's really something that bothers you, then ask again! Make sure you've read all their FAQ, and policy on returns/damaged records etc, and go from there. I've found that having patience with TMR really pays off in the long run. I'm on the "plus side" of things, by far, and I've never returned a single record. I haven't had any warped vinyl to show up either, though.

I believe that people took advantage of their extremely lenient return policy over the first few years, returning records for the most slight of defects. And due to that, they've had to draw a line in the sand on a time frame that they'll return/refund, and also outline specifically what they will accept as returns and what they won't. Nature of the beast.

Hope that helps. Later

[Alabama Woody]

It's a shame that so many people, me included have received so many warped records. I want mine to lay flat and spin smoothly. A well made 180gm record should do so. I have 0 problems ordering most times from other places . I don't get it.
I have a pretty nice turntable and there is a sound quality difference when playing a warped album .

I wish it would get better.

Then again I order quite a few TMR albums so maybe the numbers just catch up wit you.
I think they would find that if they just exchanged records for people no questions asked it would be better for them in the long run. Keep a note and once someone has complained way too much. Cut them off.

[mojoryan]

It's a shame that so many people, me included have received so many warped records. I want mine to lay flat and spin smoothly. A well made 180gm record should do so. I have 0 problems ordering most times from other places . I don't get it.
I have a pretty nice turntable and there is a sound quality difference when playing a warped album .

I wish it would get better.

Then again I order quite a few TMR albums so maybe the numbers just catch up wit you.
I think they would find that if they just exchanged records for people no questions asked it would be better for them in the long run. Keep a note and once someone has complained way too much. Cut them off.

I'm with ya, up until the last thing you said. Why keep tabs on returns for real issues, if not to get an understanding of how big the problem of quality control really is? If the same people are complaining over and over, and their complaints are legit,then maybe they just happen to be a good random sampling who happens to not be willing to accept substandard product?

[Alabama Woody]

I'm with you, I have done my share of complaining. I've decided the new mailers for the vaults and records in general was a major victory, now if they would quit putting stuff inside the 12", like ship the 45 outside the 12" - it would be perfect. As far as quality control....... I have given up....
Shame, really ,
I hope all vaults are 180 gram regardless of color, same for live records from TMR , make them blue and give us 180 gram vinyl , if doing the split really makes them make them thinner then do blue !!!!!

[Alabama Woody]

Last but not least I bet half the records they sell are not even played !

[irongiant]

Thanks for the advice. Personally, I plan to play the hell out of these, but I also plan to take very good care of them so they last a good, long time. It's unfortunate that my first experience with TMR hasn't been stellar, especially since I expect a lot from them. But based on the responses here, it's likely they shipped out records that were just fine, and they may have gotten warped in transit. I'll never know for sure. Since they seem to sound okay (kind of hard to tell with these old recordings), I'm not going to pursue it.

And, hey, they're in a helluva lot better shape than the original Paramount records probably were…. I definitely don't plan to line any chicken coops with these.